Netflix Download very slow, but speedtest is showing great speed.

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  • Updated 7 months ago
Hey,

I am sure this may have been answered before, but I was needing some thoughts or help.

My Speedtest are showing between 14 and 18 mbps, but trying to download a netflix show to watch with friend tonight is baring downloading at all..   Do I have a setting wrong or what is happening, cause I can stream a video fine.. 
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Ricky Dean

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Posted 7 months ago

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Jim16

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How are you downloading a Netflix film?  Here are instructions from Netflix.  It says only select titles can be downloaded.    https://help.netflix.com/en/node/54816
(Edited)
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Ricky Dean

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I am doing the download to watch offline feature from Netflix.. It is one of their original shows.. 

Again, I stream it seems fine, speedtest fine. but the download is ridiculous..

I have downloaded over Exede before with no issue, this is just odd..
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Old Labs

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Which plan do you have?
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Ricky Dean

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Unlimited Silver 25
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Old Labs

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Just a theory, but it's going to download at around 1.5 Mbps (or the same rate at which it streams). Video stream detection is fragile, especially over secure channels and TLS - where content headers would be unavailable and encrypted. I suspect the detection algorith for secure content simply checks the SNI (server name indication) to determine if it's coming from a known video content source. So it's going to take rougly the same time to download as watch it in real time. But just guessing... lacking any specific info on how Viasat actually detects video streams (but it's been documented that's how TMobile does it resulting in some false positives for zero rating).    
(Edited)
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Jab

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RE: "Just a theory..."

Just the facts.....btw, open connect blog

"Open Connect also partners extensively with Netflix client device teams to ensure that the content that is served by the OCAs is optimized to the specific needs of each client and the current network conditions
...
...
The playback application services check user authorization and licensing, then determine which specific streaming assets are required to handle the playback request ­ taking individual client characteristics and current network conditions into account."
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Brad, Viasat Employee

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Hmm that's odd. I wonder if it's something on Netflix's end as those speeds should be plentiful with no issue. Have you tried to clear out and try again?
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Ricky Dean

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I rebooted, are you thinking about clearing the cache?
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Michael McDowell

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Reboot everything?
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Ricky Dean

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I am going to try to reboot,, should have done that already..

Thanks also Labs,,  just to fyi, in the past it would download a 45 minute show in about 4 to 5 minutes..  so maybe they changed something..
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Old Labs

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Maybe. It really depends where the video's coming from now, not in the past (I think). But yeah, reboot anythings possible.
(Edited)
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Jim16

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"baring downloading at all.."
Sounds like it won't even try to download.
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Old Labs

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I read that as barely - he's using my spell checker.
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Jim16

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Dang!  I wish so many people hadn't downloaded your version.
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Brad, Viasat Employee

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Barley is a common one for me. Darn side-hobby!  

I still feel it's probably something on Netflix's end. I forgot my Kindle today or I'd give it a try to see. 
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Ricky Dean

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Well it is still crawling, but I guess as long as it plays well, just frustrating that it will take like 4 hours for what I had down before in like 15 minutes.
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Ricky Dean

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I just tried my Hotspot off my Cell Phone, and it was a hair faster, but not enough to truly see a difference.     So I think you are right Brad..
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Old Labs

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Who's your cell provider? Many of them are similarly detecting video streaming and throttling detected streams also depending on plan you havbe with them - again since they can't access the content header on secured connections its probably based on the SNI and all content coming off that server would be throttled not just video streams (throttled not by the content provider but rather the ISP).

Again just guessing and yes it could be Netflix also.

Taking it a step further this is why on a VPN there could be no video detection at all - you can;t detect what you can't see and the ISP only knows your going to a VPN server - whether it's fast enough on satellite to stream is another question and therationale behing J&J's suggestion to try using a VPN to workaround the inability to stream at 1080P rates.   

It's also why Fast.com gives you your throttled video rate on a speed test and my testing showed that it's not even a video being used for the test but it is secured, and is coming off of a Netflix server.
(Edited)
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L.L.

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There are only two ways to download a Netflix video today. 1. Using an iOS device or a Windows 10 device. ...and only select programs can be downloaded.
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Ricky Dean

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I am thinking that something is as Old Labs says is throttling me.. 

I am on a Windows 10 device, one I have used before.. At this point it is still downloading two episodes of Altered Carbon,, and it has been at least two hours and it is still lacking about 2/3 of each of them..  in the past, I downloaded Stranger Things and it took 15 minutes to download 5 episodes..  Something it wrong..  be it Viasat or Netflix.. when I say wrong, I just mean something has changed..   and it is ridiculously slow.. like way slow.. lol
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Old Labs

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Just to clarify, with the VPN test/trial or started working on its own?
(Edited)
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Old Labs

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If with VPN, then case closed - use VPN to overcome the fragile video streaming restrictions as well as negative impact on any non-video content coming from the same content server(s).

It appears Judge & Jury's GoldenFrog Viper VPN solution may be one well suited to satellite internet providing minimal speed loss.

However, one caveat... any VPN solution (not to mention higher quality videos) will increase inherently your data usage so you'll undoubtedly hit your data usage threshold quicker and be subject to (de)prioritization - welcome back to the world of data conservation and isolating slow periods.

Given this it probably makes sense that Viasat is charging more for higher thresholds because you'll defeat the video "optimization" - from their perspective it's all about bandwidth management.        

If it just started working miraculously - the praise the lord.
(Edited)
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Ricky Dean

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Sorry Labs, I was in a game with a friend..  Yes with the VPN..  So it seems that either our provider or Netflix is throttling.  I likely will not pay for the service, unless I have too.. I am praying that I get a plan I can stream ok, and do without the VPN..  

Yah,  I am hoping that I find a good middle..  I was doing ok being carful the amounts of HD Shows I watched,   I guess that is watch is sort of frustrating.  I do get their side, but I liked it more when it was actually me making a choice rather than being forced into a Video resolution..  again.. I respect it, but that is my option..

Thanks so much for helping me see the issue and understand it,, have a great day or night...
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Old Labs

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Everything suggests the ISP (not limited to Viasat others do it too) not Netflix from where I sit. We know what NetFlix does from their tech blog. We can only speculate what Viasat does in this case but sounds alot like what TMobile does for zero rating of videos with some of the same unexpected results.

I'd outlined the speculation on this topic back in November over in the older forum that's been shutdown now. Too bad since there was a wealth of knowledge collected over the years by those who actively participated in it.

Too bad we can't attach PDFs here I saved a copy of one of my blog entries there that cited all the supporting facts... oh well. Converting it into layman's terms is the hard part.

 
(Edited)
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Old Labs

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For those (I know there are some) who are into the technical details of what Viasat is likely doing I suggest it's along the lines of what TMobile does for BingeOn and sero rating:

http://david.choffnes.com/pubs/bingeon_sigcomm16.pdf

However, Timmy's non-technical explanation below is as goof as any for the non-techies since probably nearly every legitimate content provider today is now secured.
(Edited)
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Ricky Dean

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Just to test,  I installed Netflix on a different Windows 10 PC here, and it is doing the exact same thing..   oh well.. 
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Timothy James

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I know the issue here. The way Viastat throttles data, they are simply looking at what website it is. If they see your packets are coming from Netflix, they automatically assume that you are trying to stream a video. 1.5 Mb/s is what I get on Netflix. Even when I am downloading music from Spotify for offline listening, it is 1.5 Mb/s. I assume they did that because Spotify does have some videos. There is not any way around this that I have found, unless you want to use a VPN, but those will often put your speeds down enough to not even use it. I still sometimes just download from Netflix over night and watch it later. 
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J&J

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Deep packet inspection, and UDP streams.

Remember, Viasat has designed some really trick military hardware and detecting video streams is child's play for them.
 
There again, Viasat may have supplied NetFlix with it's IP range list and Netflix knows a Viasat customer when it sees one.

 
(Edited)
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Timothy James

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Not sure why they would consider downloading small music files streaming. There are some weird things that I have come across that have been throttled to 1.5 Mb/s that is not streaming video. 
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Old Labs

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For the reason you already stated, they're throttling based on SNI (server name indicator when using TLS) not the content itself.
 
Timmy's layman's synopsis is more likely for the technical reasons stated above.

While the TS technology exists, Viasat would be foolish to deploy it in a civilian environment against secure transmissions (HTTPS/TLS).

FWIW, Evolution plans alsohad problems in detecting content types for many of the same reasons - but folks got a free ride when HTML5 videos came along and were simply counted as web browsing not subject to the cap. Remember the outrage when it was fixed and people started burning through there caps in a day? 
(Edited)
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Timothy James

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I figured. Some services seem to perform at the magical number of 1.5 Mb/s even when it is not specifically streaming video. My only conclusion was they were throttling by the SNI. 
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Bev, Champion

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Netflix does download at 1.5 Mbps on Unlimited Silver, I don't know if Netflix is causing it or if the Viasat Traffic Shaper is failing to differentiate Netflix Download from Netflix streaming, but it is downloading at streaming speeds.
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Old Labs

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Yep for the reasons noted above and pretty much confirmed by Ricky lacking any further evidence.
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Ricky Dean

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Indeed..   
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Ricky Dean

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I am going to say this, and again, I say it respecting all of the intelligent people at Viasat, I really do accept that there are 300 different views to any topic..

However..  That Lawyer commerial..
"Its My Money and I want it now!!"

That is sort of how I feel.. 
"It's my Data and I want it now.."

Thus,  if I choose to download a 20 gig file, and it is off my 100 gigs of data before you deprioritize me,  well that is my choice... If I want to watch a netflix show and I choose to download it so I can enjoy 1080p and it cost me 4 gigs of my data.. That is my choice..  Setting it so that my Laptop or PC is spending 5 hours for a 45 minute show is really beyond fair or reasonable..  if you at going to basically say, that at 100 gigs we are going to place you behind others, and I choose too, well why are you punishing me for wanting to have some shows when my friend get here.  

Again. I am sure I am not the smartest person in the world, but this just does not sit well
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Jim16

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Again, the issue for Viasat is speed, not data. They need to keep an eye on download speed, so reducing streaming for the unlimited plans is how they are doing it.  Otherwise they wouldn't/couldn't offer "unlimited" data. They really don't care how much data you use, just how fast you can use it. Data restrictions are just one way to control a users speed.
(Edited)
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Ricky Dean

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I do get your point Jim, and if it was limited to streaming, I would even be on board. However, this is a file download.. if they get to pick and choose to throttle files, well what is truly the point of having up to 25 mbps of speed.. OH, yes up too, but still come on..  Why give anyone even 6mbps if you are going to limit the downloads of a file to 1.5
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BBwithdrawls

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Well the ole saying goes, 'There are a hundred ways to skin a cat , just dont start at the tail because he'll scratch the hell out of you " you seems to be stuck on downloading it from Netflix and I get it ,  your paying for and you want it now. Ive tried several ways to download from Netflix and Amazon and some work OK  but the thing  that keeps me up at night is the file format and the size of those files,  I prefer to download entire seasons in a HD and compressed format like .MKV and play with VLC. As noted above a simple VPN , even Operas Free VPN works well , I do like streaming Netflix and Amazon but for downloading and  playing locally there are better options . 
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Jab

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RE: "Fast.com gives you your throttled video rate on a speed test. Exede-5:163 7:30PM tonight
"
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Ricky Dean

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Jab, we must be on different plans, cause I just did Fast.com four times and the best I got was 1.1 Mbps and used Speedtest and was hitting 46 Mbps
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Jab

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I'm on original Exede-5 plan,  since 2012...so Viasat is honoring previous plans.  I only have 10 Gig bucket, so I would have to download during LNFZ.