Raised Data caps?

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Do you think Viasat will follow their lead?
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Michael McDowell

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Posted 2 weeks ago

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Homeskillet

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That was nothing but ambiguous speech. A politician could have written that. As we know "increase' could mean an extra .000000001%. I take that whole spiel as lip service.
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Voyager

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Unless Hughes and Viasat have been withholding capacity all these years, removing the data caps will not help anyone as everyone will now be using more bandwidth resulting in no more bandwidth for anyone. It actually will likely make it worse as people who were self-throttling due to their data limit will now try to use more data and thus congest the system even further. This is simple economics of supply and demand. If you increase the demand with a constant supply, you get shortages. Think toilet paper...
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GabeU, Champion

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It would definitely make it worse.  It would slow to a crawl for everyone.  
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Bradley

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No airline usage now. Plenty to go around for petty residential subscribers.
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Voyager

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And you know that how?
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Bradley

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Planes not flying?

Watching the news?
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Voyager

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How much bandwidth does Viasat normally use for airlines? Do you really think that the folks who use data on an airline use less when they are home? Hopefully, most airline passengers don’t use Viasat at home, but I still think the increase from all of the kids and others working from home far outstrips what is saved by not serving airlines. I don’t think you have any basis for your claim.
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ExSatUser

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I can say my internet in the air always streamed better than when I had satellite internet.

You might be surprised how much bandwidth is allocated to the airlines.
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Bradley

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I think if the network hasn’t already crawled to a slow mire, you already have your answer. This is 400% worse than any Christmas break.
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Homeskillet

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I can say my internet in the air always streamed better than when I had satellite internet.

You might be surprised how much bandwidth is allocated to the airlines.


While people probably don't use as much data in the air spread over their travel days as they would that period at home, there still probably is a lot of bandwidth allocated per head for air travel compared to residential usage. At $19 a flight per person per day there is no way they are going to risk a person having a bad experience because of congestion, that customer could be gone for good.
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Homeskillet

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I can say my internet in the air always streamed better than when I had satellite internet.

You might be surprised how much bandwidth is allocated to the airlines.


While people probably don't use as much data in the air spread over their travel days as they would that period at home, there still probably is a lot of bandwidth allocated per head for air travel compared to residential usage. At $19 a flight per person per day there is no way they are going to risk a person having a bad experience because of congestion, that customer could be gone for good.
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ExSatUser

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Thanks for the double post! Lol j/k

Seriously. I can stream a football game in HD with no interruption traveling across the country.

Satellite internet is one thing. Uninterrupted internet at 30,000 feet is pretty impressive to me. And Viasat was one if the leaders with that technology.
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Voyager

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Surprise me. With data, not speculation.
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GabeU, Champion

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Do you really think that the folks who use data on an airline use less when they are home?
But that doesn't mean that all passengers who use ViaSat in the air have the same at home.  Statistically speaking, it's likely that few do.  

The freed up bandwidth will likely help, but the impact is almost assuredly larger than what the extra bandwidth can counter, and probably by a good amount.  
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Bradley

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Point is the nation is on lock down. If y’all still have functional internet, rejoice. You’ve been conned.
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Homeskillet

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Conned? Explain please.
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Bradley

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Christmas slowdown?

Y’all accepted it for years. World shutdown? 2 threads on slow service?

Someone’s been drinking kool-aid.

If the pipeline isn’t completely clogged now, it never was.
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Old Labs

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Perhaps Gabe can clarify the ambiguity in bullet point 1. Did they increase capped speed or raise the data caps? 

As far as the OP's question probably not especially when the COO's first bullet point in his business conditions update states "Viasat’s residential broadband business is performing as expected to date."

https://corpblog.viasat.com/viasat-provides-update-on-business-conditions/
(Edited)
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Michael McDowell

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Sounds like they are just not enforcing the data caps.  How much more allowed data use would be anyones guess.
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ExSatUser

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Looks like they just "raised" the caps.  So in other words, you won't get slowed down as much until you go over the new "cap" level.

The other bullet points interest me.  Did they really do that, or did they just "throttle" back streaming more so everything else would be prioritized.  LOL.  I think it would be hard to identify what to prioritize versus what to throttle back.

320p for all!
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Old Labs

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Everything is performing as expected on Viasat residential... nothing to see here.

How much faster can you go if the speed limit is raised during grid lock? The explanation over in the HughesNet community I saw was more like the simply increased the capped speed not the data. Gabe how bout an assist here?
(Edited)
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ExSatUser

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You can go 60 in a 35, but only if there is not a traffic jam on the highway!
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Old Labs

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Not in Virginia, even for those radar detector scofflaws - the admiral nailed it above I think until Gabe says otherwise. We don't even now how their capped speed works - throttling vs prioritization.

But let''s raise the up to speed to 1 Gbps, bring back Evolution.

Actually speed not bad for a saturday nite prime time - 17.4 Mbps. Probably helps I'm likely the only one on my beam not over priority data. Or maybe I'm the last man standing on 329 - its great having my own beam. Amazing how quiet it is out side with no real air traffic out of DC and Richmond.  Maybe I'll turn data saver off and stream in 1080p. I'm trying to burn my priority data to see what's up.
(Edited)
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Homeskillet

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This is simple economics of supply and demand. If you increase the demand with a constant supply, you get shortages. Think toilet paper...

We will see if that analogy works, it seems to matter how hard some of us try to explain the collateral damage of removing data caps, the people who don't understand how satellite internet works do not understand it's limitations.

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Voyager

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@Home I doubt it will work. Most high school graduates can’t balance a checkbook let alone understand even basic economics.
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Homeskillet

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Balance a checkbook? My girlfriend son is 22, still lives at home. He pretty much just uses his debt card till it gets rejected. He uses the damn thing for everything. Unfortunately for him if it is a small purchase they will cover it and nail him for a $35 overdraft fee.

I can remember my last job working for the man at a large company 25 years ago. I was hiring people to fill apprentice machinist jobs, the kind of job where you have to at least know how to set up a math problem correctly enough to use a calculator to get the answer. Even if using a calculator there were people who could not convert simple fractions to decimal form. I honestly think they dumb down what it takes to graduate from High School every year.
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Old Labs

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After visiting HughesNet legal....

HughesNet's Fair Access Policies are much different than Viasat's. Their plan structure is much different using  plan service data and bonus bytes. For example, Gen 5 plans have 10, 20, 30 and 50 GB anytime data and each has 50 GB bonus zone data. On Gen 5 plans when they advertise no hard data caps they mean 
reduced speeds after the cap is reached  may be as low as or lower than 1 Mbps. No mention of prioritization behind others on exceeding the data cap. Just plain throttling to some predetermined speed. So it's easier for them to increase that capped speed limit across the board and the effect is spread more equally across all subscribers. Specifically congestion is felt more equitably by all.

Viasat doesn't have that luxury with it's more complex "prioritization"  strategy which appears to utilize a prememptive queuing strategy which greatly favors the haves much more than the have nots - where the have nots don't get served until all of the haves in line have. 

Or something like that - I'm far removed form my days of dabbling in queuing theory and don't remember all of the terminology but preemptive queuing was never popular precisely for that reason -  it really pisses off the have nots to the point of revolt and we break out the old guillotine. Those in the deprioritized queue don't don't get served until all of the prioritized queue is served. When the arrival rate in the prioritized queue is equal to the servicing rate, the deprioiritzed queue stands still.

HughesNet plan structure encourages data conservation by all and when throttled the pain is shared by all if that speed is increased. It's a more socialist approach while Viasat's tends to be a more captialist approach if you will. 

That's just my interpretation yours may differ. It like Viasat's is all spelled out in their legal section documents and Gabe can convey the reality. The HughesNet simpler plan structure and fair access policy is easier to comprehend, while hardly anyone is capable of comprehending Viasat's -  should have stuck with the classic plan structures increasing caps and easier to manage for all both Viasat and its subscribers except the intro of Freedom and unlimited with 150GB was never warranted.

I'm not sure HughesNet's throttled increase will have much of an impact but it gives the impression of being more equitable while robbing Peter to pay Paul
(Edited)
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GabeU, Champion

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Perhaps Gabe can clarify the ambiguity in bullet point 1. Did they increase capped speed or raise the data caps? 
They're kind of using a bit of word play with the "we have raised the "caps"" claim, as what they've really done is raise the throttle speed cap for when people have exhausted their plan data.  It normally tops out at ~3Mbps.  They haven't raised the data caps.  

I haven't run out of data and likely won't.  If I did, I have a slew of token data (24.6GB) that I'd have to burn through to actually go into FAP and be throttled, so I'll likely never know the speed.  And I wouldn't know if the FAP speed is higher, either, as I've never been subject to FAP in the four years I've had Gen4/5.  I'm careful with my data.  :) 

My regular speed has taken a bit of hit, but nothing that's hurting me.  I got a 9.84Mbps, which I believe is the lowest I've ever seen with my current service.  I"m sure it will get worse, though.  
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GabeU, Champion

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Perhaps Gabe can clarify the ambiguity in bullet point 1. Did they increase capped speed or raise the data caps? 
They're kind of using a bit of word play with the "we have raised the "caps"" claim, as what they've really done is raise the throttle speed cap for when people have exhausted their plan data.  It normally tops out at ~3Mbps.  They haven't raised the data caps.  

I haven't run out of data and likely won't.  If I did, I have a slew of token data (24.6GB) that I'd have to burn through to actually go into FAP and be throttled, so I'll likely never know the speed.  And I wouldn't know if the FAP speed is higher, either, as I've never been subject to FAP in the four years I've had Gen4/5.  I'm careful with my data.  :) 

My regular speed has taken a bit of hit, but nothing that's hurting me.  I got a 9.84Mbps, which I believe is the lowest I've ever seen with my current service.  I"m sure it will get worse, though.  
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GabeU, Champion

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I'm so sick of GetSat and these double posts.  SMH.  
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Old Labs

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It's a BOGO you must have used a coupon or token. It's word-smithing like that that, got Viasat in  trouble -  unlimited data. Few grasp the concept of shared bandwidth when repeatedly sold on unlimited data; even more so when all ISPs incorrectly label capacity as "speed" 

But you have so much because you're conservative with your data, saved your token data data for a rainy day. Surely you wouldn't mind if we took some of that away from you redistributing it to others or just print and send everybody 1000 GBs made up out of thin air diluting the value of your savings.

Sounds like the HN plans with a limted free zone concept of Bonus bytes are more akin  to the Viasat Liberty plans (a higher capped speed except coupled with prioritization). You only have prioritization by traffic type (QoS which everybody does nowadays) not by user it appears after reading your network management policy.

As Voyager notes it really starts with supply and demand - I want 12 donuts. I'm sorry we only have 6 at this time, how many would you like? I want 12. I'm sorry let me handle this other customer while you decide. Later, OK I guess I'll take the 6. I'm sorry, we have no donuts. Actually pretty close to a conversation I overheard in Walmart yesterday.
(Edited)
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ExSatUser

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Your speeds are pretty decent Gabe. I think Hughesnet does a decent job delivering what they do. I don't know if they do much with commercial air, so maybe that is why.
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Voyager

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I thought you had fiber?
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Homeskillet

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I wonder how many lies and stories Wayne tells in a day? I wonder if it is a school age child playing pretend. On another forum mostly geared around USA manufacturing a poser troll claimed to be a USA business owner that went out of his way to only buy from China and other 3rd world countries because American producers were nothing but over priced thieves. This was a large forum and the guy was all over it getting everyone riled up for a couple weeks.

Eventually a new guy pops up and says he wants to apologize to everyone and that the new member, USA business owner that hates American manufacturers is his 16 year old son. He said his son has issues and likes to go on the internet for the main purpose of pretending to be someone he is not and annoy people.

The father said he started doing it on dating sites pretending to be adult women looking for men. He said he was kicked out of High School so he needs internet access to get a diploma. The father monitored his browsing history and did not think
he could be causing trouble on the manufacturing site he was frequenting. Finally seeing his excessive visits he figured he better check in to it.
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Stephen Rice, Champion

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Reminds me of the early days of the internet and chat rooms such as AOL and mIRC.  Didn't think people still pretended to be something they weren't.
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ExSatUser

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Sounds about right!
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Homeskillet

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A women I briefly dated had a teenage son who sat at the computer all day during the original Napster file sharing service. He had a good library and would allow as many people to download at once that their DSL connection would handle. He would wait until the people had almost finished downloading a song and then disconnect them.

Nobody I knew had the knowledge to add to an incomplete file, so people had to start over. The little creep would spend all weekend doing this, laughing his butt off.
My lady friend would say at least it kept him out of trouble. I suppose before Napster he spent his spare time drowning puppies and pushing little old ladies in front of buses.
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Old Labs

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When I was a kid I used to call up stores and ask if they had Prince Albert in a can - I'll skip the ones about Michael Hunt and Richard Hertz.
(Edited)
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Homeskillet

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Did you also ask them if their refrigerator was running? Or call from the city sewer department and tell them you were tired of taking their crap?
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Stephen Rice, Champion

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Those were the good old days, before all this technology and caller ID.
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Homeskillet

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What do you have against caller I.D.?
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Stephen Rice, Champion

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Prank calls were a lot easier before caller ID.
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Old Labs

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Nothing but with its arrival I had to stop looking for Prince Albert... before that Ernestine never really could effectively track me.

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GabeU, Champion

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You guys are nuts.  But a good nuts.  :)  
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Homeskillet

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Rowan & Martin's Laugh-In, that even takes me back to grade school.
The sketch comedy or variety show sure was a staple back in those days.