Anyone here use email provided by Frontier (Yahoo behind the scenes)?

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Since about 8 PM on the February 24th, I have been unable to send email using my Frontier accounts. Frontier outsourced their email service to Yahoo a few years back so Yahoo is involved also.

My first thought was it was a Frontier issue since they have a long history of changing things with no customer notification and just causing things to break. Since I can receive email, but not send, things seemed only broken on the outbound side. I decided to see if I could access my accounts directly from Yahoo and bypass any forwarding that Frontier may be providing. I created new accounts on Yahoo using my iPad email client and that seemed to work from home using Viasat.

I had a board meeting yesterday so I tried email from our cooperative who uses a different ISP. Interestingly, my original Frontier accounts were able to send email at the cooperative location, but the new Yahoo accounts were unable to send. Just the opposite of at home.

When I got back home I tested and found now that neither the original Frontier accounts nor the new Yahoo accounts would send. So, I am somewhat perplexed now as to the root cause. As it seems to be an interaction between Viasat and the email provide. To test as this, I tried a Google account I created some time ago, but never use and it is able to send just fine both at home and away.

So, has Frontier and/or Yahoo been put on a blacklist at Viasat? Is Frontier and/or Yahoo having problems?. Anyone else here having similar problems or have a guess at what my problem might be?

I am not a big Google fan, but if I can’t resolve this in another day or two, I will have to close my existing accounts and move to gmail and that is a pain as I get email from a lot of people and organizations.
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Voyager

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Posted 3 months ago

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Michael McDowell

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Can you use the Yahoo Mail web page to access your accounts?
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Voyager

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Yes, accessing the server using the webmail browser interface works fine.

I just tried sending a message from my desktop using Seamonkey and got a much more detailed error message (thanks Mozilla team!). I can’t be sure, but it seems to be pinning the tail on Viasat/Exede. The error message is below with the target user’s email address removed.

“The size of the message you are trying to send exceeds a temporary size limit of the server. The message was not sent; try to reduce the message size or wait some time and try again. The server responded: =C2=A04.7.1 : Recipient address rejected: 72.173.94.65 exceeded hourly recipients threshold..“

The message I sent was about 20 bytes long so message sizes was not really the issue. And I had sent no other messages recently so number of recipients per hour was not an issue. Looks like time to try to contact Viasat support and see if they can assist in troubleshooting.
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Diana, Viasat Employee

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Hi Voyager,  Send an email with the message you received to viasatlistens@viasat.com or call Customer Care at 855.463.9333. We will escalate the issue to our email client. Thanks.
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Voyager

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Done! Thanks, Diana. I really have no idea if the issue with with Viasat or Frontier or some combination of both.
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Voyager

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I haven’t heard anything back from my viasatlistens email, but I do have an update. I checked ad tried everything I could think of on my end this morning and after a couple hours gave up. I had to run a few errands today so I tried email at several locations and a couple different ISPs (Blue Ridge cable and Verizon wireless). Email worked fine.

I just got back home and sent an email using my Viasat connection. It took forever to send (about 30 seconds), but it did send with no error! So, it looks like something is still out of whack that is affecting the speed of sending an email, but at least one message got through with no errors back from the SMTP server.
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Voyager

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I posted too soon. I went back and was checking the configuration and forgot that I had switched my SMTP server from Frontier to Spectrum so that is why my email send test worked. I just restored it to its original configuration using Frontier servers for both incoming and outgoing email and again it fails with the same error. I am going to test again at church tonight where we have Spectrum, but I am betting it will work there. The finger is pointing more and more towards Viasat as the source of the problem.

EDIT:
I did some testing tonight using Spectrum as the ISP and it appears I was wrong above and the finger is pointing squarely at Frontier. MyFrontier accounts did not work via Spectrum either when the smtp server being used was Frontier’s.

However, I can still received at my frontier addresses and I can send using google’s smtp server so it appears that issue is not with Viasat, but is with Frontier/Yahoo. Given that Frontier is on the verge of bankruptcy, I guess I should not be surprised.

I am not a Google fan and don’t really like gmail, but not sure what else to try and I hate losing the addresses I have had for 20+ years in one case. However, I suspect it is a matter of time before the frontier and epix domains disappear so I probably should make my move now.

I am leaning towards iCloud since I use mainly Apple devices. Anyone here have iCloud email experience? Any issues? I like Apple’s approach to privacy much more than Google’s. I even trust Microsoft more than Google so mail.com is an option also. So, what are your favorite email providers other than gmail? I suspect gmail will be the most popular and I may end up moving that direction, but would like to research other options first.

Anyone will to share their experience: good, bad or ugly?
(Edited)
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smurfman

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Voyager!
I am a frontier customer for 20+ years, I started with Frontier DSL, but in my area the bandwidth was just no longer good for anything, so I moved to Spectrum.

I am having the exact same issue... 

I too, went through all of the settings over and over, I went back and forth from port 110/25 and 995/465 with SSL and get the same result.
I also tried smtp.frontier.com and smtp.frontiernet.net on both sets of ports.

In all cases - I can get mail - but cannot send SMTP mail 

So I thought it was something with my Spectrum internet
I also have the mail configured on my android phone, a tablet that connects to a guess work wifi account, and mail configured through my work computer.

1) Work - same issue but the message is the 452  4.7.1 error

Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.
Server error: '452 4.7.1 <someaddress@gmail.com>: Recipient address rejected: 299.299.299.299 exceeded hourly recipients threshold.'

Where the 299.299.299.299 IP is my public IP of my work network.


2) from my phone and tablet connected to the public work wifi - I get the same error, only it is the IP of the public WiFi


3) Interesting fact ... on the phone, if I turn off WiFi and let it use data (Verizon) the message will send... my wife can get the same result through (TotalWireless) 


I did a deep scan of my wife's PC that has the mail open all the time checking... no malware.  My work PC is heavily protected at the endpoint and no malware there.


FACT:

  • Work and Home networks are blocked
  • Effects all Frontier accounts we have (3) configured
  • Effects multiple devices
  • mail.yahoo.com (the frontier login) works just fine send and receive
  • POP3 port 110 and 995 both work for getting mail - no mail has stopped coming to us, we just cannot send messages
  • Verizon and TotalWireless cellular networks seem to work
  • The issue started on 2/24/2020 or 2/25/2020 at some point for us as well.

I chatted with Frontier on 2/25/2020 (web chat) and all i kept getting was we suggest you use the webmail... RRRGGGG!!! i said no, this is not an accepted solution and to escalate.  THen i got, "we do not support outlook" ... then i got "we have learned that yahoo is having issues with no resoluton time for a solution"


Last night 2/26/2020 i called - got a very nice person who was going to remote in and look at my settings, run a few tools and see if there was something that was causing the issue... very nice... i just could not do it at that time. 

Now i found your thread here! VERY INTERSTING.


J

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Voyager

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I am still not sure exactly what is wrong, but it appears that the frontier.com smtp is broken. And given my past experience with Frontier, I don’t expect it to be fixed.

I found I could use my gmail smtp server to send and still receive on the frontier and epix email addresses, but the person receiving my email saw it coming from my gmail account rather that the accounts they are familiar with.

I also saw the same error messages you list when I used Seamonkey on my iMac as Seamonkey provided much more detailed error messages.

I think I have found a work-around that so far seems to work both at home with Viasat and away (I am in a hotel tonight using their wifi and ISP). I tried at first using the iPad’s “automatic”: Yahoo email setup, but that sets you up as an IMAP account and I much prefer POP. So, I was looking around and found the POP setup for Yahoo and changed my old frontier and epix email accounts to use the yahoo POP and SMTP servers. It seems that all my email addresses are recognized by Yahoo, even my ancient epix.net addresses and thus far it seems to work and I don’t have to get all new email addresses. So, you may want to give that a try. Just use pop.mail.yahoo.com and smtp.mail.yahoo.com and use SSL and the default ports.

If mine stops working, I will mention that back here, but so far, so good. And getting yet one step farther from Frontier is a good thing!
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smurfman

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Voyager!
Your test worked great.

i changed all of my machines to use

pop.mail.yahoo.com
smtp.mail.yahoo.com

I used 995 & 465 using SSL and requiring a secure connection - and it worked perfectly.

I think the root issue... and maybe if someone is paying attention...

When you are accessing the mail account from a 'non-approved' network (e.g. your work network or home like spectrum) there is a rule on their smtp server for relaying that is killing the connection as soon as it starts.  I tried to start a telnet (putty) session over 465 to the frontier server and the connection died right way, not message.  

Now, if i were still using slow Frontier DSL - and connected to their smtp server their rules would have permitted it.  What baffles me is that Frontier tech support could not figure this out, or that the issue is with yahoo's configuration of their servers.

Anyway... kudos to you, for testing all sorts of ways and keeping it working... i too did not want to change my account of 20+ years 

Good job!

Keep me posted if you hear anything from Frontier or Yahoo (seems like we should be able to force the issue with yahoo) 

J
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Voyager

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My network skills are a little rusty as it has been two decades since I did hands on network programming, but my persistence level is pretty much as high as ever. I generally stay after a problem until I find a solution.

I have no idea as to the root cause, but I suspect Frontier is trying to shut down their servers and hand things over to Yahoo for mail and such. However, I also suspect that most of their skilled people have left for a better work environment and I doubt they have an A team anymore. And since I am no longer a customer, I could not even chat with them as they wanted a phone/account number which I no longer have. When I contacted Yahoo I was told I had to contact Frontier since I had Frontier email accounts. The typical catch-22. Once I was finally fairly sure that the problem wasn’t with Viasat, I started trying things to see what I could get to work. Since the errors were send related, it was obvious to start with SMTP.

The gmail option worked, but was less than ideal. Since Yahoo is taking over Frontier’s email, I decided to research that further and then stumbled onto their POP configuration information and that seems to work. I just don’t have high confidence it will last. I looked at Apple’s iCloud as I really like Apple’s focus on security and privacy, but when I found they support only IMAP, I lost interest. I then started looking at Microsoft and they looked attractive. I had decided to go that direction and suck it up and get all new email addresses. I was looking at the Microsoft setup instructions when I came across a nice table of how to configure email for a lot of different email servers, including Yahoo POP. That is what led me back to trying one more time with Yahoo after my first attempt with Yahoo IMAP had failed. I wasn’t sure POP would work any better, but so far, so good. Maybe because all of my Frontier accounts were already POP accounts.

Anyway, so far, so good and I will stick with Yahoo as long as it keeps working. However, next major upset and I am moving to Microsoft.
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Voyager

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I found one additional minor issue in my move from Frontier servers to Yahoo servers. I have used Seamonkey since Netscape went under and I found that Yahoo won’t let Seamonkey access its servers. Not sure why, but probably since Seamonkey has fallen a little behind the times on late on some of the protocols.

So, I decided to bite the bullet and configure Apple Mail on my Mac. It was quite painless and access to Yahoo was not an issue. I am staying with POP for now even though IMAP is more convenient for multiple devices. I have one IMAP account on the laptop I use for my church treasurer duties and it is very slow compared to POP. It takes 30 seconds or so to sync the folders every time I fire it up. Probably if I used it every day, the syncs would be faster, but POP it is always fairly fast even if 50 new messages need to be downloaded.

From what I read, if I had access to a Yahoo account that owns my frontier and epix domain addresses, I could change a setting that allows older “less secure” email clients to work with Yahoo, but when I try to log into yahoo using my old email addresses, Yahoo redirects me to frontier. And since I am no longer a Frontier customer, I can’t access my frontier accounts. Oh well, it was probably high time to leave Seamonkey anyway, but after 25 years of Netscape and then Seamonkey, I was pretty familiar with it.
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Erick Clasen

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I am thankful for this post. I found it by searching on the text for the error itself (The size of the message you are trying to send exceeds a temporary size limit of the server. The message was not sent; try to reduce the message size or wait some time and try again. The server responded:  4.7.1 frontier mail )and it lead me right here.

My partner noticed this issue first on her machine, apparently I haven't sent out email in a while so have not noticed it.
She has Outlook and was getting bounces with the error and as these were collecting in a folder only noticed the issue when people didn't not respond back to her emails. When I tried with Thunderbird, got an immediate popup message, same thing on my iPad.
I fiddled with the settings, even tried frontier.com, but the mail.yahoo.com setting saved the day.

I've been with this email for 20 years, it works mostly. I feel that they used to have fairly OK support when it was under there control, but after a while and after changes that happen unannounced or happen and aren't necessary. One time they had something about a device specific password going on, which forced you to have different passwords on various devices. Seems like they dropped that one off again, but that they did have this whole email warning that it was coming, only to silently recall the idea later.

I have been tolerant of all of the Frontier issues and I am reluctant to dump the email too as it seems like a pain to switch over to something. I do have a HostGator account and can create as many emails as I want through that but that also has issues with Frontier and Yahoo on the incoming side. As in Frontier and Yahoo will block and bounce emails sent from that account which renders it a hit and miss when you sent someone email from any account I can create there. My suspicion is that HostGator shares the same IP among various users and someone has sent out spam in the past from the IP range, so it was put on a naughty list, which causes it to be blocked by Yahoo/Frontier occasionally. From what I read years ago this is some kind of deferred delivery. It looks for a number of similar looking messages come through the system it assumes that they are spam, holds them in a queue and using some logic that is not made public, sits on them a while then delivers them if they stop coming through in large numbers or junks them, creating a bounce message to the sender. But, it can also cause single small messages, like test messages to fail. I mention this here just in case anyone has noticed any issues on the incoming side with Yahoo/Frontier, especially with short test messages.

For clarification, I used smtp.mail.yahoo.com on T-bird, Port 465 Connection Security: SSL/TLS Authentication Method: Normal Password Username: myemail@frontiernet.net

On Outlook smtp.mail.yahoo.com as well. But I had to go to the Advanced tab by clicking on More Settings and set the port manually to 465 as it was still at 25 from the previous Frontier smtp settings that worked up till a month ago and manually set to SSL as well.


(Edited)
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Sarah

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I too just found this post. Thank you everyone for the good information. I have been using the same default email app on my Android phone for over 2 years now for my Frontier email address. As of today it has stopped allowing me to send mail out, but I can retrieve mail. I tried a few of the tips I read in this post, but I think Frontier/Yahoo has "blown up" on my phone. Here are the error messages I also received quite randomly out of the blue today:

Connection problem. (554 5.7.1 sender address rejected: Access denied)

Connection problem. (452.4.7.1 recipient address rejected: 166.176.249.24 exceeded hourly recipients threshold)

Liars, neither of those messages had any merit. So I tried the tip about changing the outgoing to "smtp.mail.yahoo.com" and using port 465. No luck. I've never had problems with my email until today. What the heck?

Am I out of luck? Should I even bother continuing to use this ancient email address anymore if I can no longer use an email app to faithfully send my mail, or has anyone found another fix for this issue?
Thanks for any help and blessings.

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Voyager

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i am not sure what to tell you. The configuration I described earlier here is still working for me. The error messages you posted sound pretty familiar to what I was getting. I am not sure why the solution doesn’t work for you.

I am not familiar with Android as I have been an Apple using since the Blackberry days. On the Apple devices, when you create an email account it has an option specifically for Yahoo! and the email basically configures itself with no need to manually enter server names and ports. It does all that behind the scenes and doesn’t even show you what is set up. For the SMTP server, it just says “Yahoo! SMTP server”

Does Android not have a built-in auto configure for the larger email providers like Yahoo!?
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Admiral Korbohuta

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Yahoo has been having downtime this week off and on affecting different parts of the country. That may be part of the problem.
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Sarah

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Oh hi, that was was a fast response, thank you. I'm also not sure how similar the Android and Apple programs are, but I did check my app and it has the preset "Yahoo!" email settings too. That was how I set my email address up 2 years ago...only for it to one day randomly bottom out on me. I'm also able to check the port numbers after set up, but changing them didn't help. =/

When I login to my email through the Yahoo! browser it still works, but I find it much more convenient to check my messages no the app. The whole thing is bizarre. But then I read this post today and it seems Frontier is continuing to decline, and Yahoo! isn't up-keeping the emails either? So if they don't support the email clients and apps I guess it's about time for me to switch email providers.

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Sarah

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@Admiral Korbohuta Ahh thank you, that is good to know. I wonder if the Yahoo downtime affects my phone app/client too.
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Voyager

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With Frontier in bankruptcy, I don’t see things getting better any time soon.
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ExSatUser

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The real question is who WONT end up in bankruptcy before all this is over. 

Yahoo and Google are pretty safe though. 
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Voyager

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Hard to tell, but Frontier was long gone well before the unconstitutional government shutdown. I left Frontier 16 months ago to come to Viasat if that helps put things in perspective.
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ExSatUser

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Yea. I know Frontier has had its problem.

Then there was MCI. An Adelphia.

What is it about these telecommunication companies!
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GabeU, Champion

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I don't know about bankruptcy, but I can envision lawsuits coming CenturtyLink's way.  Their infrastructure is terrible.  
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GabeU, Champion

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I don't know about bankruptcy, but I can envision lawsuits coming CenturtyLink's way.  Their infrastructure is terrible.  
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Sarah

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I've had Frontier for internet service for a few years, because I can't stand Comcast... but I may have to look into new options. I did not know Frontier was doing so terribly. I wonder if they will sell out to a bigger company soon. I will look into Viasat as a back up option at the least.
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Sarah

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I've had Frontier for internet service for a few years, because I can't stand Comcast... but I may have to look into new options. I did not know Frontier was doing so terribly. I wonder if they will sell out to a bigger company soon. I will look into Viasat as a back up option at the least.